Archive for January 2010

not the burden of proof! noooooo … (religiopoint)   Leave a comment

religiopoint

not the burden of proof! noooooo

the burden of proof is all up to the believers … why?

to put it quite simply if some anti-non-believer says it’s up to the non-believer to somehow prove that god doesn’t exist (yes that’s the argument)… i don’t play that game, to that i say,

what case for the “burden of proof” does a non-believer need to make?

the case to be argued has *not* been established so any answer to that question means that the other person is making up the case right then and there in front of you to be argued IN THE FIRST INSTANCE.

burden of proof, is on the person making up the argument in the first place..

i’m not arguing there is a god, go with god, see if I care… and instead of ranting let me leave you with a great quote…

“toodle loo – go with god – and don’t take any wooden nickels”
–George Carlin


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Posted 28 January, 2010 by manabrau in M.S., Religion Sux Arse, T.E.A.M.S

me is no atheist: the god idea … (religiorant)   Leave a comment

RELIGIORANT

the god idea …

this is a spin off of the “me is no atheist” blog because that blog was so long, it needed to be split up, even though i said i wouldn’t split it up… mostly written, 4th July 2009, mostly ….. this is the last of four parts …

THE GOD IDEA

I’m not sure who (or what) gave me the god idea, maybe I got it from church in general but I sort of had a fear of god, somehow, by not doing the right thing, but when it came to actually doing “wrong” things, the fear of god never entered into my mind to not go and do those things, (so fearing god, was pointless again) my fear was that god would make my life worse than it already was, simply for me being me, regardless if i did anything wrong, and god did just that, it kept on making my life worse…

I don’t know how serious I took it, or maybe it was coz I saw “The Omen” too many times, but at one stage my young brain figured that I’d father the anti-christ so it’s probably a good thing that I don’t have kids.. that was the message I got from the god idea.. that I was going to do something extremely evil in the future, so god got in and punished me pre-emptively, smacking me down before I’d even opened up my mouth.

so I came to hate god, hate the church after learning about the crusades and the inquisitions, hate what god had done to me, hate him for making me look like this, hate him for the way people treat me, hate him for the times even when I’m right that I’m still somehow at fault, hate hate hate… so I grew up with the concept of god punishing me for something i would never get to do in the first place *because* i was punished *pre-emptively*, so for me god had interfered with my life somehow – that’s all i had, none of the religious idiocy that went with it was attached, as it seemed i was “allowed” to not be involved in “church” anyway…

I tried praying a few times, but I felt saying prayers was empty and silly, I vaguely remember a couple of churchy sports things on the town oval a few times… but the only thing i got from christchoonity was “do unto others as you would have them do unto you” and that “Jesus loves everyone” …

and “do unto others” is the only thing from the bible you actually need to know.. as for the rest of the bible, hmmmmmm… a waste of time and effort is a polite way to say it…

Puff, the magic dragon,
Lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist
In a land called Honah Lee.
Little Jackie Paper
Loved that rascal Puff,
And brought him strings and sealing wax
And other fancy stuff.
Puff, the magic dragon
Lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist
In a land called Honah Lee. Oh!
Puff, the magic dragon
Lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist
In a land called Honah Lee.
Together they would travel
On a boat with billowed sail.
Jackie kept a lookout perched
On Puff’s gigantic tail.
Noble kings and princes
Would bow whenever they came,
Pirate ships would lower their flags
When Puff roared out his name. Oh!
Puff, the magic dragon
Lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist
In a land called Honah Lee. Oh!
Puff, the magic dragon
Lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist
In a land called Honah Lee.
A dragon lives forever,
But not little girls and boys.
Painted wings and giant rings
Make way for other toys.
One grey night it happened,
Jackie Paper came no more
And Puff that mighty dragon,
He ceased his fearless roar.
His head now bent in sorrow,
Green scales fell like rain,
And Puff no longer went to play
Along that cheery lane.
Without his life-long friend,
He could not be brave,
So Puff that mighty dragon
Sadly slipped into his cave.
Puff, the magic dragon
Lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist
In a land called Honah Lee. Oh!
Puff, the magic dragon
Lived by the sea
And frolicked in the autumn mist
In a land called Honah Lee

but then eventually – god went away, forgotten, I never even noticed that he’d gone, just like Jackie Paper did to Puff the Magic Dragon when Jackie grew up…

but god was forgotten… that took fifteen years to happen.. I think.. I also found that by ignoring what god did to me, I was able to see all those other people that god had fucked around too – and once you see them, you can see that you aren’t alone – so it’s not just personal – god’s fuckups were every where

but then you have to wonder about these people who are really hurt or deformed or terminally ill or in a hopeless situation of sorts – and they *still* believe in god… those people would need to some serious comfort if they lost their religion .. but that’s a dependency – a drug – a narcotic… this is no different to going cold turkey with some hard core recreational drugs…………..

so I’ve no doubt that when people give away their religion, how fucking scary it is, but there is nothing to fear, except the fear you create yourself, to paraphrase whoever it was who said “there is nothing to fear but fear itself” – Kennedy was it? Churchill? FDR? I forget…

going from believing to non-believing is like taking your shoes off and walking around bare foot on the carpet, it feels strange at first but u get used to it, but then you realise that you are noticing more because your feet can actually feel the ground – you just have to remember that you aren’t invincible and can’t walk on hot coals or broken glass or go bare foot when it’s cold and rainy – but I try to avoid those situations even when i am wearing shoes anyway.

so having forgotten about the satanic devil christian god, after all there is no Satan without god, i thought that being a believer was something that went away with age, like .. Satan, urrr.. I mean Santa Claus, and the Easter Bunny (what do bunnies and eggs have to do with some dude being tortured urr nevermind) and Tinkerbell and Peter Pan and various other fantasy stories that filled out our imaginations as children..

sidenote: I wonder if all these happy go lucky stories we tell kids are told to soften the blow of life being a real pain in the mangina? I mean how wonderful was it to believe in a magical man who brought you pressies every year, even if the “price” was to be ‘good’ ??

is Santa Clause the short term version of Jesus? eg. kids stop believing in Santa eventually – so having that let down early in life will prepare them for bigger let downs, later on in life… ie. Jesus and god and girls and boys and etc.. well, u know what i mean.

but all of that is slipping away, we are growing up faster and faster, there are school kids that can do the jobs of some of the fuck tards i work with, seriously… most of these hackers out there on the internet, are *bored* kids.. imagine that boredom put to good use? but no, we have all these stupid laws to make things “fair” for people who don’t deserve it -ie. the stupid morons who pretend to write software and get paid for it but they can’t get fired coz they’re FULL TIME GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES … you practically have to murder someone to get the flick from the Aussie government 😀

we are living more and more in every day, I forget where i read it but, compared to only a few decades ago, we are living thirty eight hour days or something like that… forget about the exact numbers, as regardless, it makes perfect sense. All these time saving things we do and devices we use, allow us to do way more than we used to do. Shit, even in the past few years paying the rent or the bills has become something that takes five minutes a week on the phone to accomplish, but ten years ago, it took me twenty minutes just to make the walk to the real estate agent and pay the rent and come back again.

it’s a roller coaster ride, and I must say that I find it exciting – people holding back science are spoiling the fun we could all be having – I want to fly in from the asteroid belt everyday to go to work… having found myself a nice quiet rock to live on….

maybe this is why we are growing up faster, the harsh truths of the world that our parents used to cushion us from can’t be hidden any more thanks to the demand for information, so we need to know these harsh realities earlier and earlier on in life, otherwise we’ll get used as chumps and pawns in somebody’s power struggles or taken advantage of by some krusty character.

For instance: if you grew up in a small town and everyone was genuinely caring and looking out for every one else in the community, you probably wouldn’t have much crime, so there’s little reason to warn kids about talking to strangers or even locking your house up, as there aren’t any strangers.

but growing up in a city with thousands of people most of whom you don’t know, it would be prudent to make sure your house is locked and to tell a young child to not talk to strangers (that’s just the first example i can think up, i’m sure there are better examples actual parents could come up with)

Toffler said,

“The illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read and write, but those who cannot learn, unlearn, and relearn.”–[Alvin Toffler]

with computing being the most rapidly changing thing i can think up off the top of my head, there is often a need to unlearn and relearn re-un-learn all the time. like every time i buy a new computer, the technology is slightly different, so I have to relearn what hardware I need to get the most bang for buck (I put my computers together from parts, when someone says that they have a “Bitza” Computer.. it means bits of this, bits of that)


Posted 27 January, 2010 by manabrau in M.S., Religion Sux Arse, T.E.A.M.S

me is no atheist: jesus was the hero that saved the world… (religiorant)   Leave a comment

RELIGIORANT

jesus was the hero that saved the world…

this is a spin off of the “me is no atheist” blog because that blog was so long, it doesn’t really cover similar topics to the other parts of “me is no atheist”, it just needed to be split up.. mostly written, 4th July 2009, mostly …..

JESUS WAS THE HERO THAT SAVED THE WORLD

that’s what christianity was to me – and that’s ALL it was – do unto others, Jesus loves *everyone* and being meek is how we all get along!! And by typing all that out now I realise, that the idea of Jesus dying, well, that makes me angry.

Very Angry

Jesus was the hero that should have saved the world, got the girl, and lived happily ever after until he was an old man, all the while continuing his preaching. Imagine if Jesus taught love and compassion for everyone for fifty years instead of the pathetic handful of years he was around? Imagine if Jesus made it such that his teachings were spread all over the earth. Imagine if he made this one simple statement that could not be erased from history because it was given to **all** the cultures on earth:

“Those who commit harm or justify their bigotry in my name will burn forever in hell”

or even making the statement,

“Satan is not to be feared, he can do you no harm where he is now! Satan has been defeated! The only evil in this world now is the evil in the hearts of man, born of their desire to be selfish.”

Maybe he did say something like that, and the evil men with their greed took it out because they wanted all these sheep to fear something evil and intangible .. “Oh the Devil made me do it!” .. that’s what i reckon – the bible has been tampered with – this is a known fact – so anyone calling it the unfettered or perfect word of god – is lying – i find it hard to lie – so i found it hard to be christian – as I’m too honest to be a christian

I WILL NOT FOLLOW A BIBLE THAT WASN’T WRITTEN BY JESUS HIMSELF

and since that isn’t going to happen any time soon, christianity is a write off, end of story.

i mean the four gospels are all slightly different in their accounts of Jesus! pffft! and Paul, many biblical scholars agree, that he didn’t even meet Jesus or only met him briefly, and YET!!! half the new testament was written by him!! (allegedly)

“things that make you go … hmmmmm”–[C and C Music Factory]

Paul made him self an apostle!! I’m sorry – but wake up – he “converted” *after* Jesus’ death! how does someone who never or barely knew what Jesus was about, know what Jesus spoke about? It would have to be second hand knowledge at the very least. So this Paul guy claims to have been spoken to by god – but did Jesus mention this Paul guy, at all? So if he were sent by god, Jesus would have known all about him .. and probably told his followers, “hey if you meet a guy called Paul, and he claims god spoke to him, then pay attention to him… the secret pass phrase he will tell you is .. ‘toddle loo, go with god, and don’t take any wooden nickels’ … and if he doesn’t say the pass phrase – then he’s a FAKE!”

christianity is like the train wreck that you just have to keep watching simply because it just keeps going and going and going and just when you think it’s about to lose momentum, more carriages come into view only to further stack up onto the pileup.

Christians need to ask them selves this:

Wouldn’t you *want* the bible to have actually been written by Jesus himself?

well? seems to me the contradictions in the bible give head room to start making up your own bullshit ideas, seems to me christians REVEL in these very contradictions. But these are conclusions drawn from the bible lore – isn’t that blasphemy – fucking Revelations says not to add to this book – even *I* know this much of the bible. And I bet if Jesus was here today, he would punch you in the nose for being bigoted against *any* person just because they are different. That’s what I would expect from the Jesus *I* was taught about.

The bible says that Jesus did not come to bring peace, but a sword… damn straight baby, to all the fucking religious nut bags who are being hypocrites…

Someone said when Jesus comes back he’s going to be pissed off big time, and he’s going to say “All you Christians, GET THE FUCK OVER HERE AND SIT THE FUCK DOWN” or something like that… Bill Hicks, Robin Williams and a few others have done similar skits.

Robin Williams is probably a bigger influence on me than Jesus, same with George Carlin, Carl Sagan.

Jesus is just another smart dude to me, and it doesn’t matter if he didn’t exist, the idea of Jesus was a good one, it’s just that the stupid fuck heads who claim to follow him have got it wrong.

Posted 27 January, 2010 by manabrau in jesus, M.S., Religion Sux Arse, T.E.A.M.S

me is no atheist: my earliest religious memory… (religiorant)   Leave a comment

RELIGIORANT

my earliest religious memory…

this is a spin off of the “me is no atheist” blog because that blog was so long, it needed to be split up… mostly written, 4th July 2009, mostly …..

my earliest religious memory, as hazy as it is, is that of me being in Sunday school along with a bunch of other kids with the chairs arranged around the outside of the class room facing inward so we could listen to the Sister standing up in the middle of the class room doing the Sunday school thing,

I remember listening but then, looking around the room at all the other kids to see if anyone else was accepting what was being said, I suppose. I remember having this feeling along the lines of “is anyone else buying this?” it may have also been like that situation when u hear something funny, but before u embarrass yourself and burst out laughing you look around to see if anybody else is laughing, or at the least have a smile on their faces in acknowledgement of the joke.

I seem to recall asking questions of the Sister, and I also seem to recall not going to church very much at all after that … in fact i’ve probably been to a church twice in the last twenty years and one was a funeral, the other a marriage, and no more than a few dozen times in my entire life, so about as often as most christians, hey?…

and from the little I remember of being in church itself, was the getting sore knees from kneeling and I remember thinking, how can they make old people kneel down like this? and also i remember not knowing the words or the tune to the songs being sung. religion would be so much more popular if the songs (psalms?) were rock anthems like Queens’ “We will rock you” or stuff like “teach your children well” ..

click HQ the sound is great… it’ll soften the blow of the video…

You, who are on the road
Must have a code
That you can live by
And so
Become yourself
Because the past
Is just a good-bye
Teach you children well
Your father’s hell did slowly go by
And feed them on your dreams
The one they picks
The one you’ll know by
Don’t you ever ask them why
If they told you, you would cry
So just look at them and sigh
And know they love you

And give of tender years
Can’t know the fears
That your elders grew by
And so please help
Them with your belief
They seek the turf
Before they can die
Teach your parents well
The childrens hell
Will slowly go by
And feed them on your dreams
The one they picks
The one you’ll know by
Don’t you ever ask them why
If they told you, you would cry
So just look at them and sigh
And know they love you

But just from that tiny bit of exposure to biblical teachings, I do remember having a fear of death and dying, but that fear faded, but left was a fear of god.

a totally undefined entity that I somehow, feared. But fear of the unknown is pointless. Pity i didn’t know sooner.

In fact it’s entirely possible that religion had nothing to do with my perception of god at all, as I didn’t have much of a fear of hell, not that I recall, all I feared was god making my life worse and worse…

but one useful thing I did get from catholic church, in retrospect, was that the idea that conferring with the Priest or Sister was a *good* thing when you had questions about the bible et al, none of this bullshit coming up with your own interpretations of things like these fucktards do today.. space is a fucking ocean, the earth is fixed in space, the universe moves around the earth every day, ra ra ra, my arse!!! although moving the universe around the Earth is definitely a *worthy* task for a god, so if there is a god, it spends all of it’s time concentrating on spinning the universe around us once a day, because only a god could move things *Way*Way*Way* faster than the speed of light!!

ie. just beyond the orbit of Neptune, there is a point where anything further away from us needs to be travelling faster than the speed of light in order for the stars to move around us in a day…

So if this is true, then I demand every one stop praying, RIGHT FUCKING NOW!! as you might distract god from this task and in the space of a nanosecond distraction, the universe could fly apart, because we all KNOW this god made mistakes. eg. gave us free will, but we decided to be evil, but then gave us commandments millennia later.

can we say, “too late fuckhead?”. that god dickhead should have given us the commandments *right* at the start when we supposedly got kicked out of Eden. what a dumbarse this god is, hey?

The amount of christians that have blatantly gotten the bible wrong is disgustingly appalling – where is the head of the christian actually at? It would be too polite to say they obviously have their heads up their own arses, but if that were the case, wherence for thou art cometh the *new* stupid ideas?

I didn’t really need any more convincing that religion sucked and sucked arse, as I was a study freak as a kid. I learnt all about the crusades and the inquisitions long before I figured out that it was the very same church to which I was supposedly an adherer that did all the bullshit I’d been pointing the finger down upon …

the christians killing people in their crusades – tens of thousands of them in Jerusalem, in one battle, over one day.. I had no concept of Jews and Muslims, I mean I knew they were other religions, but I had no idea about how they were linked with christianity…

I was taught that Jesus loved everyone, that the meek would inherit the earth, that you should do unto others as they have done to you… no that’s what I meant … someone treats me nice – i treat them nice in return – someone treats me bad – they’ll get the same back, and probably all the previous “bad” they sent me that I had previously tolerated, back at the same time to boot – yes i had it sort of backwards – do unto others as you **would** have them do unto you – seee! – i got it right eventually… but I could never understand the whole crusades…

actually, I got the meek would inherit the earth from Monty Python,

Oh, it’s the meek! Blessed are the meek! Oh, that’s nice, isn’t it? I’m glad they’re getting something, ’cause they have a hell of a time.–[Monty Python]

in fact I think my first twenty years of biblical exposure was mostly Monty Python and a bible that my grand parents had when i was seven or something, mostly. There’s little doubt in my mind as to why christianity is mostly hilarious to me

there’s something there… if u want to destroy a child’s concept of christianity… Life of Brian will help a lot!

Posted 26 January, 2010 by manabrau in M.S., Religion Sux Arse, T.E.A.M.S

me is no atheist, or how i learned to lose my god and love satan   Leave a comment

RELIGION-SUX-ARSE

mostly written, 4th of July 2009, mostly….. i thought i’d post this instead of trying to finish it off, as the recently non-believered might get some value… another long blog and it’s not really finished, past topics have been spin-offs from this blog, as it’s been in my “edit queue” for so long at nearly half a year some of the things I cover spawned whole blogs themselves, hence, this blog is very sporadic….. .

i am no atheist… or how i learned to lose christianity and love the bomb, Satan, The Force!

BAHAHAHAAHHA @ the title…. i couldn’t make up my mind

i never really thought of myself as a christian, *ever*, when ever the topic came up – I was *Roman*Catholic* – but as a child none of that meant anything to me anyway, i learnt a couple of prayers but that was about it – i seem to have these prayers still memorised so that really does highlight how easily a young mind can be imprinted.. eg… such prayers as …

“twinkle twinkle little star how i wonder what you are?” … you know the ones.. what about this christmas prayer? “he sees you when you’re sleeping” etc etc etc

but i don’t consider myself an “atheist” today either, as that is just another label that someone else uses to describe me when it comes to religion or my lack thereof, so in fact, it has nothing to do with who or what I am, so it’s hardly a surprise that i don’t think of my self as an atheist, because being an atheist means *nothing*..

Nothing *AT*ALL* … and *that* is what I thought the idea of being an atheist was about – no preconceptions about things that are not verifiable, in particular, god

so apart from *not* believing in a sky daddy, is there one thing that can be said about anybody that would make them an atheist? (you should consider that a CHALLENGE, coz i’m stuffed if i can think of one thing, let alone a BAD THING)

I keep doing those online tests and I mostly get “atheist” but once I got “satanist” and once i got “Islam” – but the strange thing is – Roman Catholic, the religion that I was taught, apparently, was always at or near the bottom of these tests!

many people think that an atheist is supposedly the opposite of a theist… but what I don’t understand is how there can be an opposite to believing?

OPPOSITES v urrr.. ahem… OPPOSITES

you see, believing requires actions on the part of the believers, right? you have to actually *do* things to be a believer, save a prayer until the morning after like Duran Duran, go to the church of the poison mind like Culture Club, believing in your own Personal Jesus like Depeche Mode did, you frakking know, all those believerish type of things.

but the opposite of believing requires *inaction* or abstaining from, or not doing any of those believerian type activities in the first place… eg. is doing nothing is somehow the anti-proton of believing?

think about that would you? this highlights the extreme idiocy of people who get upset that their “faith” has been challenged by the non-believer. doing the literal nothing, is all it takes to oppose the beliefs that some people have.

that’s like the number zero being able to be bigger than the number one.. that’s like winning a fight that you know nothing about… that’s like taking an exam that has no questions on it, but you still get a 100% score… any believer having a problem with the non-believer, well that’s all the believers problem.

ironically – god existing or not existing – is an argument that you can not win, but you can lose it by declaring that you lack the very faith you claim to have.

so how is doing “nothing” the opposite of believing? I could go for a run, or I could do the opposite and do nothing … but is that really the opposite??

doing *nothing* is the default position. think of a circle with the exact middle as the default position, move to any spot inside that circle, and you can chart the opposite position by drawing a line through the exact middle and continuing on for exactly the same distance as you are from the middle of the circle. but what is the opposing position of the exact middle?

an opposite is opposed to something … what is the opposite of running? is it running backwards, or is it running in the other direction that’s the opposite?.. well what’s the opposite of running? it’s not standing and doing nothing, is it?

insert any random thing u do – is doing the opposite of that thing, doing nothing?

if that’s the case then doing nothing is the opposite of everything you do … and doesn’t that mean that the opposite of nothing, is *still* nothing?

no, I think that the opposite of running, is actually *not* running. and the opposite of nothing, is *not* nothing.

doing nothing is not the fucking opposite of what ever it is you are doing, the point here is that atheism, does NOT have an opposite – as there is nothing to oppose.

think of it this way: someone says they believe in god, but then they ask me if I believe, and I say “well I never really thought about it actually” (which actually used to be true), meaning that I haven’t decided about my position about god, so is not making a choice, really the opposite of making a choice? Is my position really the opposite of the believer? What if I didn’t even know there was a choice to be made?

No! my position, is akin to standing on the exact middle of the circle. If you make a choice, it’s the choice you make that decides what it’s opposite is.

if you stood in the strong wind and did nothing you would get blown away, you have to exert the *opposite* force against it to not fall over.

THE LOTTO

let me use another analogy.

if you buy a lotto ticket, you are either a winner or a loser, if you don’t buy a ticket, you are *neither* a winner, nor are you a loser. However, even if u don’t play the lotto, most of you are *still* aware that people play lotto, but it just doesn’t appeal to you….

Some players will think the non-players automatic losers for not bothering to play the game, but some of the non-players will consider the players automatic losers for playing this game every week and wasting their money, and yes you could win if you do play, but the odds are astronomically against you.

Point is, the opposite of a believer, is a non-believer.

for many people, they use the label “atheist” as if it’s a positive, it is not a positive, it’s the neutral position, so I reckon that it should not be used in that context of positive or negative, as it confuses those poor religious people and their “god did it” brains..

when somebody asks you what your religion is – if you consider yourself an atheist – you should say “no religion” or simply say “none”

GOD DENIAL? WELL, IT’S REACTIONARY, THE BURDEN OF PROOF IS ALL YOURS

i believe this is the basis of the “burden of proof” argument being on the **believer**. My position as the non-believer, is the default, it’s the believer that needs to bring proof to the party, because I did *nothing* to arrive at my beliefs, NOTHING AT ALL…… I didn’t move off the centre of the circle, so just how is the burden of proof on me, the non-believer? Just how is the non-believer supposed to prove *nothing*? How do you prove you have not moved off the centre of the circle? Yes it obvious to you that you haven’t moved, but someone else, they wouldn’t know. They can’t know. Because they are thicky thicky, thicky thick.

I vacated my mind of any “belief” in religion and god, and I make *no* claim that there isn’t a god that wasn’t in reaction to someone else saying that there was a god, so it’s not like I go around trying to sell the idea that there is no god. It’s *all* reactionary.

i think this is the problem with the perception of atheism – some people seem to think that all atheists used to believe in god so they are NOW actively denying god as some sort of mantra to make god go away.. I also sometimes get the impression that believers think non-believers say such things just to piss them off, as if it’s their believer RIGHT to bullshit about their fantasies and that we will accept what they have to say as a matter as fact. I only ever deny god about two seconds *after* some religious person tries to sell me *their* god, so it’s reactionary.

It’s *always* reactionary. and my reaction is often one of … mocking .. ok then, *snickers*, be a believer!! *snickers*

I would never have thought to deny god if no-one made a speculation that there was, I always say “well, what makes you think there’s a god” … and nothing i’ve heard is anything but lame … basically most people believe coz their mum said they should… If the religious don’t want their god laughed at and mocked and denied, if they don’t want what their mummies told them when they got tucked into bed to be disassembled and revealed to be a lie – then they can keep their god personal – like they are supposed to.

It’s also very important to realise that it’s THEIR god that is what is being denied, the god that *they* claim to “know” is what is being denied. There could be a god, but fucked if I have seen anything to make me think that anybody’s *particular* god is *the* god, and the bullshit I have heard about god, is far below par of what I would expect from god anyway. “god made the universe hey? seems making a universe was pretty easy for god, what else has god done?”

Obviously I’ll repeat what I’ve said without being prompted to other people about god at times, probably after thinking about more ways about how incredibly wrong someone was with their god speculation, but even still, it was the *believer* that tipped that scale of mine in order for me to blab at them, “WHAT?!?! BULLSHIT, there is no way that *your* god exists, your story just does not make sense, where did you get those ideas?…”

when the non-believer is given a religious scenario (aka a STORY) by the believer, and then the non-believer thinks about it for two seconds and then says “what?!?! that makes no sense, show me!” .. the believer then has no right to get upset when asked for proof.

The people want you to follow their religion, but just because they were stupid enough to believe what somebody told them, doesn’t mean the same will happen with me. and seriously, I don’t give a shit that it was a case of them being indoctrinated at a young age. Children, are *not* dumb, they can figure things out for themselves. I figured out religion was a heap of bullshit long ago, lost me at about the flood story i think it was. I was ten or so.

It is the irresponsible parents who do NOT teach their children about critical thinking that are the problem. If something doesn’t make sense, teach the child to ask for clarification. Teach them how to find out for themselves. and there is no excuse these days with google and such.

so if it wasn’t for loud and outrageous claims, “THERE IS A GOD!! BECAUSE I SAID SO!!” there would be no equally loud questions asking for some proof of this “god” thing in return. And *seriously* — these nut cases must take our silence (eg our TOLERANCE of their BULLSHIT) about these tall tales as some sort of an agreement with them, that’s how arrogant some of these nutcases are… I know. I’ve been told as much, and in no uncertain terms, “I am right, because I say so” .. that’s what they say – in spite of their demanding that it’s the bible that says so, because so often these fuck heads have got the bible completely wrong, it’s the *person* and their twisted interpretation of how they read the bible, that is who is saying “there is a god”..

if you don’t say shit to them, they think you are on their side – this is something I have proven many times – eg. i have had civil conversations with christians – all is sweet and nice, at first – but then the christian finds or figures out that i’m not christian – and *then* they start speaking to me like I’m a piece of shit…

go FUCK YOURSELF if you are one of those people. Religion of tolerance MY ARSE.

FREE WILL? I CAN ALSO NOT MAKE A CHOICE, RIGHT?

People who actively deny god are like the lotto non-player types who say they refuse to play the lotto, “well.. OK… so don’t play the lotto then!” .. it should be a case of not needing to say that you don’t believe in god, but it’s not, like I said above, people take your silence and tolerance of their bullshit as an affirmation that you are agreeing with them, probably because their arrogance is so huge they don’t think that someone else could possibly think differently to them.

The way I see “atheist” – is that you wouldn’t think of the concept of god in either a positive or a negative way.. This is the same as the person who isn’t a “lotto denier” nor are they a “lotto player”. They are aware of the lotto concept but it doesn’t faze them either way. and while they are technically in the same bucket as the “lotto denier person”, in that they don’t play, it doesn’t occur to them to play or not to play *either* way, so they are certainly unlikely to be a “lotto hater” .. the people who actively deny the lotto, probably do this as a reminder that they not waste their money, maybe they’re owing some money to their bookie? or had a bad experience with god, I mean, the lotto…

It occurs to me just now, that people might not be able to grasp or “get” the concept of not choosing a side. Why is that a problem? ARE YOU DUMB? ARE YOU STUPID?

it’s like do you go out with “Chris” or do u go out with “Saddam”? Does it really not occur to people that freedom of choice, aka “FREE WILL” (that thing “god” gave us), also means not making a choice at all?

Another way of looking at it, is if the “lotto denier” walked into the newsagent, saw the lotto games, and then said “I do NOT wish to purchase a lotto ticket thanks” to the attendant, why would you say that if you weren’t a mental case? or even if they said something along the same lines to themselves, “no! I won’t buy a lotto ticket” in spite of seeing all the advertising. A “lotto denier” would be akin to an aggressive or militant atheist.

A true atheist is the person who doesn’t care either way, and would be the person who walked into the newsagent and didn’t think about any of the lotto games available, and just got on with what it was they were doing there in spite of having their senses overloaded with colourful banners enticing them to play the games.

well at least that’s how I see it

* * * *

i’ve described three perspectives above but really there are *four* sides of the argument, if you want to be really technical.

{{those that are believers}} /
{{those that are non-believers}} /
{{those who don’t care}} /
{{those who are unaware of the whole thing in the first place}}

((i came up with a fifth one too – which could have been those who don’t know what to believe, the “I want to believe” group, i guess there’s a sixth one too, those who “do believe, but don’t want to”, which is probably a transitional and temporary state of mind heading away from belief, the “I want to believe” might be transitional towards belief… but i’m making shit up again ))

i’ve no idea which group would be the biggest as a lot of people outright lie, they say one thing, but mean another, or don’t want to seem weak-mind by taking a position of doubt, but some of that lying is actually unintentional, because of brainwashing. The truth is, not making a decision about god would be the most prudent and sensible thing to do, and saying “I don’t know”, is the beginning of wisdom.

i would put myself into the don’t care bucket, or at least I’m working towards that. you might point out that i *do* seem to care a fair bit about religion, but – it’s entertainment – christianity is like a great big murder mystery horror drama movie where you gotta figure out who the bad guy is, coz no-one has said anything that makes sense just yet, so the punch line of the whole movie is still yet to come, if it EVER comes at all.

I’ll be very annoyed if the BUTLER DID IT.

actually what I *do* care about is religion staying away from science, as the two don’t belong together.

religion == train wreck, morbidly fascinating … or maybe like masturbating with a cheese grater, slightly amusing, but mostly painful.

* * * *

(((
((this bit doesn’t fit in, but i’ve left it))

but anyway: having the priest explain the bible when you don’t understand keeps the majority in-line with the same ideas. It wasn’t until the 1600s when the bible first became available for the regular person to read. Until then, only the clergy would be able to read the Latin or whatever it was written in, that the common man couldn’t read. I’d imagine that’s why ppl went to church, they weren’t able to read the bible themselves. and who could afford a book in those days anyway?

Which is why Catholicism out numbers all the other christian cults put together i would imagine. The church tells them how to interpret the bible, this way people don’t go off getting their own ideas, and if they do have questions, then they are to confer with their Padre! That’s what I was taught.

This may sound weird coming from someone who is anti-religion, but if you’re going to have religion, then everyone needs to be believing the same thing, otherwise your religion is a joke, and that’s all it is. The way I see this is that basically, these born again christian types each have their *own* version of christianity..

so in fact there isn’t something like 30,000 different sects of christianity, not from what I’ve seen. I would suspect that there is actually closer to millions of versions of christianity, seeing how every “christian” i’ve encountered on myspaz (about fifty or so) seems to be on a different path, be it a slightly different path, or a massively wrong path. The point is if fifty ppl seem to have christianity all over the place, then what does that say for the rest of them? It probably means they don’t know what to think, but still say they are christians anyway …

Gandhi said something along the lines of “In reality there are as many religions as there are individuals.” .. i tend to agree with that assessment, although Gandhi was talking about the Hindu religion at the time, but it also applies to other religions.

)))

I AM THE EYE IN THE SKY

so yeah…

Religion was just another one of those things that I grew out of that wasn’t really given a serious look at in the first place, strange that it is so normal to *not* be indoctrinated into stupidity…

Imagine if I was raised as if Star Wars was a fact, how would I be received as an adult in the “real” world? Would I not be ridiculed for being a “Jedi”, regardless of how many good things I got out of this fiction, it’s still fiction, it doesn’t become *real* when I “just” believe in it. Telling other ppl they “just” need to believe in The Force, doesn’t cut it.

“Oh you just need to believe in Star Wars before you watch it” … This is no diff to “You need to believe in Jesus before you read the bible” .. at least the Jedi don’t condemn you to hell for not wanting to believe in The Force.

If George Lucas is considered the Messiah in two thousand years from now, the stories he told, would still be stories. The same with other “scripture” – they are stories – which may be based in truth, but they are still stories. You can still like those stories, you can still learn from those stories, but the universe is pretty big, it seems a bit silly to draw your world view from a small set of people, when there are millions of people who have something useful to say, who can give you a universal view, world views are too small these days.

although, I must admit, that even with a limited “knowledge” of god, I did spend quite a few years worrying about what god would think of what I was doing… but that was never an “at the time” thought, so fear of god didn’t stop me being a little shit, god just made me feel bad about being myself, just by existing… but this doesn’t imply that I believed *in* god, believing *in* something is supposed to be a good thing, thoughts of god were never a good thing to me.

I had no fear of hell, coz I knew I wasn’t doing anything wrong, i just was never *good* enough… and now that I’m typing this out, this “god” being, making me feel bad about myself could have certainly contributed to the depression I suffer now, yeah so on that front… Fuck you god!!

I am the eye in the sky,
looking at you,
I can read your mind,
I am the maker of rules,
dealing with fools,
I can cheat you blind.
And I don’t need to see any more to know that,
I can read your mind.

–[Alan Parsons Project]

Mainly coz I was convinced god hated me, so I hated him back, I always thought if I met god, he’d better explain why I was given such a crappy hand, i used to be sooo selfish…

but that faded too…

then one day whilst in my teens i was asked if I believed in god.. I said that I didn’t really believe in god and the reply to my statement was “oh.. so you’re an atheist?” … so I said “atheist? what’s that?” … as I was an un-christian, or a non-practicing catholic .. but I always happily admitted to being a Rooooman Catholic, coz it sounds so much more… hmmm, exotic?

A true atheist wouldn’t even realise that they were, just like a christian would never tell you that they were, their actions would speak for themselves.

HAIL SATAN

Oh of course, because I don’t believe in your god that makes me an agent of Satan… of course, since I don’t believe in one of your gods, you expect me to believe in the other god you worship, Satan!! If it wasn’t for Satan there’d be no evil right? And if there was no evil, there wouldn’t be any good, so god would be out of a job, right? … christians must love SATAN so much…. right? gotta keep that evil around, just so we can have good…. right??? that’s why god won’t kill Satan, he’d be out of a job, and who’s going to hire god after that?

“Oh, yeah Mr God, I’m afraid, that you are over qualified for this job, it says here you made the universe, well, we just want you to flip burgers and fry chips, I’m afraid you will be rather frustrated in the limited scope of the position we have on offer..”

Right about the same time as first hearing the term “atheist” at least in reference to me – i was into heavy metal and with my hate for god, I really got into the likes of Slayer and lots of others that escape my brain at the moment.

oh and I *still* think it’s fucking hilarious that the term “atheist” even *exists* – the default position is complete ignorance of god. think about it, if somehow you were cut off from every person who had heard of god and you grew up not knowing about this god thing *at*all* – how would you know about god? I mean u could suspect that there might be some sort of super being, but you wouldn’t have the mental image of an old man in the sky daddy christian god who loves you but at one stage killed everyone on earth and that we are all inbred seeing how we came from one man and one woman, now would you? hmmm?

So Satan was my buddy, coz all the music i listened to was evil, it was great… but nobody really cared, they were disturbed sure, but no more so than for any other strange thing kids do to act out, in fact my mother liked a lot of the music i liked….

but if anything, my time as a heavy mental, ahem, metal fan, taught me that in the seasons of whither, the children of the beast, should stand and deliver, and be strong, and laugh, and Shout at the Devil



Posted 25 January, 2010 by manabrau in Christianity, M.S., Religion Sux Arse, satan, T.E.A.M.S

we are not learning from history … (historant)   Leave a comment

HISTORANT

we are not learning from history …

i’ve heard it often said that “the victor writes history in their favour” or something like that …

yet it seems that we are too arrogant to think that the history we know is wrong

often history is written with the facts of events presented accurately – but people are too stupid to ask what happened because of these events…

“oh look Helen, look what the bad guys did back in the bad old days”.. that’s how history is presented, it’s presented as a shiny object, all the dull rusty sharp edges are smoothed over..

people need to ask *why* did these things happen in the first place …

have you ever seen two kids fighting and the big kid has stomped the little kid, and because the little kid gets a broken bloody nose, ie. the little kid was hurt the worst, so nobody stops to ask what the little kid did.. they just think the big kid was being a meanie, coz the big kid, has been known to be a meanie in the past…

now the big kid maintains that his attack was perfectly justified, but no-one wants to hear why any more, because the little kid has cried so much and was so hurt and so mutilated and so humiliated, that *everyone* instantly picks on the big kid, and ridicules him and makes jokes and mocks him but …

still …

nobody asked the big kid why he broke the little kid’s nose by giving him a good punch, and eventually the tale of the little kid being punched by the big kid becomes so large, that no gives a rats arse about why the big kid did what he did, it would ruin the story.

why ruin the truth, with those pesky other points of view

but eventually some people do ask, well kind of, they have to read the history books about the event, because it’s too late now, as the big kid has long since died, and these curious people ask the question…

“Why did the big kid hit the little kid?”

and it turns out that somebody did have a different take on the “history” of that event, as it is rumoured that the little kid had taken the big kid’s money, in fact, the little kid, had taken the big kid’s entire family’s fortune, they were broke.

But often when you ask why and what happened, the little kids start asking you why you are being pro-big kid?…. they even have laws put in place, to protect the little kids from the big kids.

I’m not saying that the big kid did the right thing, far from it, but nobody saw what the little kid did, so a useful perspective on the events is often reduced to rumours, so all we see, is the seemingly over the top display of big kid retaliation.

But in my experience, the measure of the retaliation is usually in some sort of proportion to the initial event that caused the apparently over the top reaction.

just say, all the little kids had been taking money from the big kids for decades, and the big kids have just stood back and let the little kids look after the money they took. But each blow has a wearing down effect on the big kids and eventually, the big kids were scrambling to eat, to clothe and house their families…

in fact the whole big kid country is now in economic down turn, because the little kids have all the money

then one day…

a little kid, tries to take the big kids money again, and the big kid says NO! THAT’S ENOUGH….

and then the little kids get upset, but they have so much money now, that they can screw over the big kids, by getting all the little kids all over the world to pick on the big kids, in fact they are so rich now, they can hire other big kids to pick on the initial big kids, on their behalf.

President Barack Obama launched an extraordinary attack on the Supreme Court on Saturday, saying a ruling on corporate donations to political campaigns this week “strikes at democracy itself.”

Obama’s broadside was triggered by a 5-4 ruling by the court’s justices on Thursday that removed long-standing campaign finance limits and allowed corporations to spend freely in campaigns for president and Congress. In the ruling, the court’s conservative majority said the limits had violated corporations’ constitutional right to free speech.—
Obama says court ruling a blow to democracy

I have a very bad feeling about this…

Olbermann: U.S. government for sale

and people in my country want to emulate the USA political system… long live the Queen I say….


Posted 23 January, 2010 by manabrau in history, idiots, M.S., rant, usa

extreme believer arrogance – miracles/prophecies … (religiorant)   Leave a comment

RELIGIORANT

extreme believer arrogance – miracles/prophecies…

this is an extension of a previous blog about “just how dumb are believers?” …

PROPHECIES? .. WHERE?

I *laugh* at every prophecy … well, i roll my eyes at least

seriously, what prophecies have come true? I’m thinking they are all, lies? affirmations? mantras? hoaxes? ahem … perhaps, BULLSHIT, is the right term?

why do ppl even need these predicted events? if they look forward to some prophecy fulfilment, are they not demonstrating that they lack faith by needing these “events” to provide some sort of validation to their faith?

and what if it *does* come true? will they then say, “told you so!” in selfish arrogance?

if Jesus returned tomorrow after 2000yrs of his followers saying that he’ll be back “soon” – it better be fucking good, I expect at least Metallica or Foo Fighters as a support act, or Boston or Toto.. TOOL would be a good support act for Jesus. Nirvana should not be too much of a tall order for Jesus to get as a support act either. hey? alright! do it!

every single prophecy I heard of that has “come true”, has merely been true because the person telling the story wanted it to be true with their vague interpretations of events.

if a prophecy was actually true, would we not learn about it in school?

“…and in history class today kids, we’re going to learn about Jesus, who rose from the dead, and saved the world from nasty sinners so that we may be here today.”

and even if by some stretch of the imagination, you can say that maybe there is some similarity between a prophecy and real events…. well…. so what? what’s the big deal?

what prophecy that’s supposedly come true has been of any consequence anyway? .. oh i hear you, standing up the back, shouting, “Jesus came true!!!” .. sit down and shut up, because by your own faith’s reckoning, Jesus became some super god dude and all that jazz, of his *own* accord!

Did we need a prophecy to make Jesus come about did we?

and what difference does any prophecy coming true have to do with anything anyway? does it makes some difference to having faith or not?

Jesus’ return has been on the cards for nearly 2000 years, listening to christians going on about the return of their lord is akin to listening to someone brag that they are going to win the lotto, every week, but then after fifty years of bragging, the guy finally wins, and then becomes *insufferable* with the bragging of saying “told you so”, all the while forgetting that he spent twice as much money than he won.

MIRACLE SCHMIRACLE

miracles? I say miracle schmiracle, what’s that you say, one person inexplicably had their cancer totally disappear? one person? that’s it?!

fuck the religious and their grasping for every shred of justification for their embarrassing fantasies…

can we aim a little higher people? perhaps, just a little bit? we can do baby steps if need be…. hmmm? *sigh*

a *Real* miracle, would be finding a cure for AIDS, or developing crops that could grow in spite of harsh conditions, and then distributing that to the entire world without care for making a profit out of it, as well as providing military support to dissuade looters and piracy of these foods and medicines…

Miracles are quick fixes of hope, the religious equivalent of a hit from the bong, a line or line of coke, they fade soon enough, then you’re back to how you were before.. looking for the next miracle fix just so you can feel all warm and fuzzy about hearing some ratification of this “faith” you claim to have…

ppl keep saying christ is going to return.. have you heard that story? I have, heaps of times, but it seems to remind me of that other story…. have you heard that other story, the boy who cried wolf?..

PROPHECIES AGAIN

.. but i’m sick of hearing about prophecies, oh yeah the rapture is going to strike in five minutes like a thief in the night, dude you said that like five minutes ago, and u said it yesterday, and last week, and it was actually the first thing u said to me when we “met” – so uhmm – howz about shutting the fuck up for a bit hey?

this is another display of extreme arrogance, god returns to rapture *everyone* up and take them to heaven, well, who says *you* are a part of this “everyone” that is going to be raptured up to heaven, anyway? hmmm? Is this not an extreme self adulation to tell yourself that, out of the entire universe, that *YOU* are special, that *YOU* have somehow arbitrarily chosen the god that made the universe, even though there are hundreds, maybe even thousands of gods that “made the universe” ????

and what are these people saying and admitting to anyway? would they not rather the world continue on as it is? or would they be happy to see the world destroyed and have everyone wiped out except for the twenty or so ppl who are saved??

anyone who *wants* the rapture to happen can go fuck themselves – it’s pretty simple to understand, and it can’t be dumbed down much more, if you want the genocide of the human race to happen, you’re an arsehole.

the genocide of the human race, is not something to look forward to you stupid pricks!!! fucking hell!! The Hitlers and the Stalins and the Maos killed millions of people – your Jesus wants to KILL BILLIONS.

Hitler and Stalin and Mao all combined added together, cannot even hold a candle to this Jesus you keep going on about.

and why do people who say they look forward to the rapture get upset when you tell them to shut the fuck up?!?!? their reaction is like you told them to get fucked when all they said was that they were going for a walk down the street to get a loaf of bread.

I can’t believe born-again-rapture-me-up-christians are so nonchalant with their verbal diarrhoea of the slaughtering of mankind in some final battle between good and evil.

a battle which, mind you, only took place since we’ve been around, you know those fuckers, god and satan, could have done this whole final battle of few thousand billion years ago, but no, they decided to bicker after *we* arrived…

that’s a bit sus don’t cha think? just a bit of co-incidence, hey??

the final battle for all good and evil – which could have raged at any time in the last trillion to the power of a trillion years, just happened to start, right about the same time we began to tell stories! what’s the chances of that?

DANG! what a co-incidence??!

you know if the bible is true, by some twisted version of the word “true”, then this battle between good and evil, came about because of *us* – somehow us being here made things go bad, right? So if everything was hunky dory before we got here, and if there was no evil before us. can we assume that without the “black” of evil there isn’t the “white” of good either, as everything would be a shade of grey with neither good nor bad around? that sounds very Buddha-ish …. Buddhism also just happens to be the only religion I can think of that doesn’t have a god, another co inky dink.

so if *we* are the cause of all good and evil, it’s just tiny baby steps to the conclusion that *we* made up the whole religion / god thing, isn’t it?